Friends & Health

Stanton Shanedling: Hello, everybody! Welcome to Health Chatter. Today’s show is on friends and health — in other words, what do friends do for our health? We have an illustrious group of discussants here with us — Clarence and Matthew. So, it’s just the three guys talking about friends and friendships.

Welcome, everybody! We have a great crew as always — Maddy Levine-Wolf, Eron Collins, Deondra Howard, Matthew (who’s on the show), and Sheridan Nygard. Second to none — they provide wonderful expertise. And frankly, Clarence and I truly believe they are friends as well as colleagues — great, great people.

Clarence Jones is my co-host on this show. We’ve had a lot of fun doing it, and we continue to try to be creative and hopefully informative for you, the listening audience. Human Partnership is our sponsor — a great community health organization that does wonderful things. I’m always impressed when Clarence tells me, “Oh, we did this today,” or “We did that last week in the community.” It’s really, really good. Check them out at huemanpartnershipalliance.org.

And you can check us out at healthchatterpodcast.com. All our shows are there — you can read about them or even read full transcriptions if you prefer that. Check us out!

So, it’s really interesting — I’ll be blunt. About two and a half weeks ago, I lost a very dear friend I’d known for 45 years. In many ways, I want to dedicate this show to him — to John. A wonderful man. In his later years, John was suffering from Parkinson’s disease, and the complications from it finally took him.

I’ll be frank — when I heard John had passed, I sat in a chair in my home and just cried my guts out. It really hit home. You’d think that as you get older, you could deal with this better — but frankly, it doesn’t get any easier when you lose good people and good friends.

John and I always connected in unique ways and kept up with one another. He always remembered my birthday — he’d call every year. I always knew he would call. I hope he rests in peace.

But I really want to underscore how special it is to have good friends — and what they do for our health.

Clarence: You know, when you first brought up this topic — friends and health — I went and approached one of my friends, someone I’ve had many conversations with around prostate cancer and those kinds of things. Unfortunately, he couldn’t make it this time.

But part of why this topic is important is because a good friend will tell you, or be concerned about, your health. I have friends who say, “Hey, you’re eating too much candy,” or “You’re getting kind of bigger.” It might seem small, but it’s not — it means they care.

That’s what you look for in a friend: someone who tells you what they see. They may not always be correct, but they’re not saying it out of spite — they’re saying it because they care.

So this whole idea about friends and health is very important, especially as you get older. There are things you don’t always see.

Let me give you an example. We did a barbershop campaign — we talked to barbers about discussing health with their clients. A barber can be a friend — someone you confide in — but they can also notice things, like a spot or a mole, and tell you to get it checked.

So friendship and health — it’s important. It just looks different in different ways.

Stanton: Yeah, you know, it’s interesting — I’m sure both you and Matthew have gone through this. Some friends you keep in contact with a lot. Some you don’t talk to that often — like, I have a friend out in Los Angeles who I don’t talk to regularly, but when we do, it’s like picking up right where we left off. You still care about each other.

I realized that caring for one another is central to health — it really helps you.

Now, the other thing I was thinking about — I’ve been going through some personal stuff. And inevitably, people reach out — almost daily. You included, Clarence. Out of the blue, I’ll get a call: “Stan, how you doing?” It’s not a deep question — it’s just a checkup and a check-in.

And Clarence, I know — if all hell were breaking loose, you’d drop everything. “Stan, let’s get together.”

That kind of thing is very meaningful and helpful for one’s health.

Clarence: Yeah, as you were talking, I thought about friends and mental health. What you just said touches on the mental health aspect of friendship.

But there’s another side too — sometimes you have friends who might not be helpful for your health. You need to recognize that. You can be friendly with someone, but if they bring stress or drama, you have to regulate that.

You need to recognize the level of friendship you have with people and manage it.

Matthew: Yeah, to jump in here — I think friends are incredibly important. Every major milestone, every accomplishment, every hardship — I’ve been surrounded by friends. It really speaks to community.

We build our communities and circles of friends. I have “realms” of friends — like Stan mentioned, some I don’t talk to often but can pick up with anytime. I have family friends who are more like cousins or siblings. Then there are “friends of the moment” — people from a former job who you bonded with through a tough boss. Each type of friendship is valuable in its own way.

My grandmother used to say, “You are who you run with.” When you surround yourself with people who motivate you, push you forward, and prioritize mental health and community — you benefit from all that.

But the opposite can happen too. If you surround yourself with people prioritizing unhealthy habits or things that don’t align with your values, you can fall into that as well.

Friendship has also changed with social media. What it means to be a friend, how we interact — it’s different. Hearing you both talk about phone calls — for me, it’s often liking posts, sending messages when someone does something cool. We just connect differently now.

Stanton: Yeah — and there are things you realize friends bring to your health. Some friends I wouldn’t necessarily confide in about a health issue because we just don’t connect in that way. But others do.

For instance, last Friday, a very dear friend of mine — who I actually invited to be on the show — called and said, “Stan, what are you doing tomorrow?” He had an extra ticket to the Gopher game. By the way, they won 66–0 — crazy!

It was so spontaneous. We went together — and spontaneity can be healthy too. Friends bring that out.

Another thing — the tragic event that happened right in my neighborhood recently. The unfortunate killing of two children and injuries to over twenty people. There’s a lot of neighborhood angst right now.

But you can see how people come together. It’s not always just friends — it can be neighbors, colleagues, even acquaintances. Certain events bring people closer and help with our health.

Clarence: Yeah — thanks for bringing that up, Stan. You’re taking a lot of my points! But I’ll bring another angle.

When I was growing up, everybody was a friend. That’s what we looked for — friends. As I’ve grown older, I’ve realized I also look for allies, associates, colleagues. I have all kinds of levels of engagement, and that’s healthy.

Because I know what to expect from each relationship. Having a clear idea of how you define a friend — and others — really helps keep you healthier.

I’ve had colleagues who disappointed me. If I’d considered them friends, that disappointment would’ve hit harder. Sometimes those disappointments have less to do with the person and more with the situation. You have to manage expectations — life doesn’t always work that way.

Stanton: You know, I’ll have you react to this, Clarence. When we first met, I’d define our relationship as professional colleagues.

Clarence: Yeah.

Stanton: I remember it well. We worked together on community health initiatives — collegially and professionally. But over time, that relationship has really morphed into a friendship.

Clarence: Yeah, absolutely. I remember meeting you at a Blue Cross Blue Shield event. I was sitting there talking to you, and what struck me was how transparent you were.

When you meet people for the first time, you often get their title or position — not who they really are. But you were open about what you were about and what you were looking to do. That made working with you so much easier because I didn’t have to guess about you.

That’s how I see friendship — I don’t like having to guess about people. If something’s off, my friends will tell me.

I think you know him too, Stan — my friend Sam.

Stanton: Yeah, we’ve had him on the show.

Clarence: Sam has no problem telling me what he thinks. And I love that — because I don’t have to guess about him. As a human being, that’s something I really value.

Clarence: It’s that kind of transparency — and you and I have always had that from the beginning. That’s one of the things, for me, that really shows what friendship is. And I also know you care about me, because you look out for me — that’s that health component too.

Stanton Shanedling: You know, it’s interesting. Clarence, I know you had a health issue you were dealing with, and I don’t know if you recall, but I said, “Clarence, put me on your speed dial.”

If something comes up — I’ll be honest — I’ll be pissed off if you don’t contact me when you need help. Come on, what the hell is this all about?

Clarence: Yeah.

Stanton Shanedling: So, you know, the other thing is kind of the hug you get from friends. There are times when you feel as though your friends are wrapping their arms around you — for whatever reason. And there are other times they don’t need to put their arms around you. They’re just… friends.

Clarence: Yeah.

Stanton Shanedling: And there’s no question about it for really good friends.

Now, let me talk about the loss of friends. Obviously, I mentioned earlier — losing a friend through someone passing away. But what about friends who haven’t passed away… but you decide they aren’t your friend anymore?

Why is that? Is it because they’re not helping your health?

Clarence: I think… yeah. I think that as you start getting older — and I think I mentioned this a long time ago — but when I was younger, I had a grandmother. My grandmother would say things, and I’d be like, “Oh, Grandma, don’t say that!” She’d talk to people and say stuff, and I’d go, “Grandma, that’s not nice.”

And then as I’ve gotten older, I’ve become more like my grandmother. You learn things. You don’t put up with as much. And I think that when it comes to your health — and your friends’ health — sometimes you have to disconnect.

As you grow older, you start to really see people. When you’re young, you miss a lot of signs. But as you age, you start noticing — “Oh, this person’s very narcissistic,” or “This one’s selfish,” or “This person thrives on drama.”

Then you start thinking, for my health, I need to disconnect.

But one of the things for me is — I never discard people. Unless you really did something big. For the most part, I just say, “Right now, our interests aren’t aligned.”

That, to me, is the best way to say, “We’re not working together right now.” But I do think people change. We change. You have to keep checking in.

You can’t assume that just because we’ve done something the same way for years, it’s still working. We just had that conversation today — we’ve been together a long time, but you’ve gotta check in and say, “Hey, how’s this working for you?”

If it’s not working for you, or not working for me, there needs to be an adjustment. It’s not good for us to keep pretending we’re okay when we’re not.

Stanton Shanedling: Yeah, yeah.

Clarence: That’s why I think having a friend who’ll tell you the truth — like, “Man, you got on my nerves” — is important. It might not feel comfortable in the moment, but that’s what you want.

There are things about ourselves we don’t see that someone else can help us with. And that doesn’t mean they’re our enemy because they tell us the truth. That’s what I always think about friendship — you’re not my enemy because you tell me the truth.

Stanton Shanedling: Yeah.

Clarence: I might not like it that much, but…

Stanton Shanedling: Correct.

So, what’s coming to mind when you were talking is consistency and obligation.

Consistency means you can have a steady relationship or friendship with someone over a long period of time. The consistency is how you move through life together.

If those paths stay aligned, the friendship stays aligned.

The other part is obligation. I’ve come to realize that being a good friend isn’t just a social thing — it’s also an obligation of caring.

Being there when the other person needs you — that’s deeply tied to health.

Clarence: Yes, and I think part of it is also being fully aware of what you want to give in a friendship — the energy you have.

Because a lot of people will say, “You’re my friend, so you need to do all this for me.” And I’m like, “Whoa, hold on. I’m your friend — not conditional — but I also have to take care of my own health.”

If I do everything for you, it’s going to mess me up and mess up my other relationships.

So, we have to have those boundaries.

But I wanted to ask Matthew a question.

Stanton Shanedling: Yeah.

Clarence: Because Matthew’s from a different generation than you and I, Stan. I want to talk about friendship in his generation. What’s the real expectation of friendship among people your age?

Matthew (Health Chatter): I think my generation has become a lot more transactional in some ways. And I think social media has helped facilitate that.

It’s so easy to know so many people now. You follow each other, you see their posts, what’s going on in their lives. It’s easier to keep up with people — but that doesn’t mean it’s easier to have a deeper connection.

So I’d say I know a lot of people and what’s going on in their lives, but those close, traditional friendships? I have fewer of those — or I have to put in real work to maintain them.

I think I just have more acquaintances now. I can follow along with people’s lives, but that’s different from being close.

There’s also something I’ve been seeing that really resonates with me — everyone wants to be part of a village, part of a community, part of a connection. But it’s becoming harder and harder to be the villager — to show up for the village, for your community, for your friends.

I don’t think the expectations have changed — life has. We’re stretched thinner than ever. We’re working harder, there’s political turmoil, stress is at an all-time high — and then friendship expectations get added on top of that.

It can make things harder. And it’s not that I don’t love my friends — it’s just realizing not everyone will be in my closest circle. I have to identify who’s a colleague, who’s an acquaintance, who’s someone I want to really build a connection with.

As I enter adulthood, I’m realizing relationships take a lot of work — friendships take a lot of work — and finding that balance can be tricky sometimes.

Clarence: Yeah.

Stanton Shanedling: You know, at some point we’re going to do a Health Chatter show about “Should we just medicate?” — remember I mentioned that to you, Clarence and Matthew?

But I wonder — and this is kind of rhetorical — are friends a kind of good medicine?

Clarence: Well, you know what, Stan? Let me say this. I was recently reading some information — can’t recall the source — but it said that men have fewer friends today than they did 10 or 15 years ago.

Stanton Shanedling: I read that too.

Clarence: And they’re more lonely. Yeah, and that’s the thing — in spite of social media and all that, people are lonely.

I’m not making assumptions, Matthew, but I think a lot of people have associates — lots of them — but they’re lonely.

You have plenty of associates, but you don’t even know if they’re telling you the truth.

Stanton Shanedling: Yeah.

Clarence: That’s the thing — people post on social media about how great their lives are, everything’s wonderful — and then you hear something tragic happened, and you’re like, “Wait a minute, I thought it was different.”

So part of friendship and health is figuring out: how do you find a healthy friend?

clarence: But I think that part of… part of the… the idea about friendship and health is, how do you find a healthy friend?

Stanton Shanedling: That's clean them.

clarence: Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, but how do you find a… how do you find a healthy friend that can help you also maintain or to regain your health as well? And again, this is not about using anybody.

clarence: But this is about utilizing people.

clarence: That can help to take you to a different level.

clarence: you know, and help you to understand better what your needs are, so… Yeah, yeah.

Stanton Shanedling: You know, so I gotta, I gotta reflect on something for, for all of you.

Stanton Shanedling: a week and a half or so ago, I was out east with my son and his family, and

Stanton Shanedling: One evening, we went out with

Stanton Shanedling: A few of my son and daughter-in-law's friends, and

Stanton Shanedling: And it was really interesting. You know, I was kind of second fiddle in that dinner, you know, I was, you know… but regardless, it was really interesting, the conversation I was listening to, because they were all connected.

Stanton Shanedling: as friends, Through the fact that they had kids.

Stanton Shanedling: And so the whole, you know, frankly, much of the conversation for the evening was, this activity that we're bringing our kid… did you sign this kid up for karate? Did you sign him up for baseball? Did you sign him up… are you going to the pool today? Are you going… and it's just, like, this commonality.

Stanton Shanedling: of, interests.

Stanton Shanedling: At… at that point. And it struck me of, whether or not that can be maintained.

Stanton Shanedling: Are they… are they connected by virtue of their kids, or are they connected truly as,

Stanton Shanedling: friends, you know, as you would really think. And how… and if so, how are they nurtured? How are, you know, whether… how do you nurture it if you're dealing with it because of your kids, vis-a-vis how do you nurture it

Stanton Shanedling: because of… because you… you care about these… these… these people. So it's,

Stanton Shanedling: in that sense, it's kind of generational, I guess. The other thing, Matthew, that I wanted to relate to is, you know, when Clarence and I were growing up, we didn't have all these technological

Stanton Shanedling: connections.

Stanton Shanedling: Okay? And,

Stanton Shanedling: And so consequently, you know, I remember as a kid, you know, friends meant that, you know, you'd go out to the park and play baseball.

Stanton Shanedling: You know? Or we go on a bike ride together.

Stanton Shanedling: Or we would just do, you know, hide and seek in the neighborhood, you know what I mean? Just, like, whatever it was. And, now it's technologically

Stanton Shanedling: connected. And, and I wonder… and I'm not making a judgment if it's wrong, I think it's different.

Stanton Shanedling: I think it's different. And,

Stanton Shanedling: And, you know, we'll see how… how it… how it morphs going… going forward. But, you know, it…

clarence: I have a question.

Stanton Shanedling: Yeah, go ahead.

clarence: Okay, I didn't mean to cut you off, Sam, but…

clarence: I have a question. What happens when the… Internet is out.

clarence: I mean, you know…

Stanton Shanedling: Right!

clarence: I mean, I mean, among friends, I mean, you know, it's, you know, I wonder if the internet was out for 3 weeks, I mean, for 3 days.

clarence: I'm wondering how people would respond to that.

clarence: You know, how people would… how people would… would find ways to stay, connected, or how they would find ways to,

clarence: to take care of themselves. I just…

clarence: I don't necessarily have to have an answer, I'm just sitting here, it just came on my mind, like, well, what happens if the internet goes out for 3 days? What are they gonna do?

clarence: You know…

Stanton Shanedling: Yeah, or…

clarence: And…

Stanton Shanedling: Or you lose your phone, or you break your phone. It's just like…

clarence: sweat.

Stanton Shanedling: It's like, oh my god, you know, that means I have to go knock on my next-door neighbor's door? Yeah. Oh my god, you know?

clarence: Damn.

Stanton Shanedling: Yeah, so… So, alright, I want,

Stanton Shanedling: Another question I have is, what is… what do you have to do to maintain a friendship.

Stanton Shanedling: Or be a friend.

Stanton Shanedling: going forward.

Stanton Shanedling: Matthew, what do you think? What do you… what do you need to do?

Health Chatter: I think you have to show up.

Health Chatter: And I think that's the best way to put it.

Stanton Shanedling: Yeah, wow.

Health Chatter: smallest terms. You have to show up. When your friends need you, you show up. When they need assistance, you help.

Health Chatter: And you show up.

Stanton Shanedling: Right.

Health Chatter: I think…

Health Chatter: that… I really resonate with this, like, I really… I've been thinking about what it means to be a good friend a lot lately, and…

Health Chatter: I think… Especially nowadays, in a world where we're

Health Chatter: all pulled in a million different directions. The fact that you took time out of your day to show up for someone else speaks so…

Health Chatter: loudly about, you know, your relationship and what people mean to you.

Health Chatter: But I think that's just really important. I think…

Health Chatter: Oftentimes, social media kind of projects this ideal, or this perfection, that doesn't

Health Chatter: actually exist in reality, and so I think sometimes my generation can fall into this trap of, if it's not perfect, we don't do it, or you wait till the moment is perfect.

Health Chatter: Whereas, I think maybe we need to move in a different direction of show up even when it's not perfect, show up even when you're tired, show up even when things are a little difficult, and help your community, and help your friends, and show up for each other.

clarence: I like that. I think that… I like what you said, show up, but show up authentically, right?

Health Chatter: Yes, 100%.

clarence: Yeah, that's the thing that… that really… when you're, when you're off.

clarence: people can tell, you know what I mean? You know, you go in and you say, this is how I'm feeling, not as an excuse, but just as a way of explaining, you know, if you're not 100%.

clarence: And I mean? And I think that part of what happened with people is that they feel like they got a smile and grin and all those kind of things, and…

clarence: I would… I would not want that. I just want you to be who you are, you know? And that's why, for me.

clarence: People that tell me the truth, I like them.

clarence: I mean, because I don't have to get… you know, look, man, look, I have so much stuff on my head, I don't want to be guessing about you. I mean, if you don't like me… and I tell people this, if you don't like me, just tell me. I'll be cool with that. I mean, I may want to know what I did, maybe, but if there is no reason, because a lot of times people don't like you for no reason, I mean, just… it's not even about you, it's about them.

clarence: You know, but what you want… what you want in terms of relationships is you want… you want authenticity. You want… you want to be… you want to be in a place where you don't feel that you have to pretend.

clarence: I mean, and, you know, when you start talking about health, that's one of those things is where you have to pretend something? Come on.

clarence: You know.

Stanton Shanedling: Right, right.

clarence: It's hard.

Stanton Shanedling: Yeah, yeah. You know, you mentioned, earlier, Clarence, the idea of transparency.

Stanton Shanedling: You know, it's like when we first met, you thought I was, you know, transparent and just, you know, right out there, and you didn't have to… you didn't have to go through a litany of… of thoughts in your head in order to get to who Stan is.

Stanton Shanedling: Cause you're here.

clarence: Let me check you out, though, Stan.

Stanton Shanedling: You did. I mean, yeah.

clarence: No, no, I did check it. I mean, I like what you're saying, but I'm like, I'm still betting, though, buddy, okay?

Stanton Shanedling: Oh, yeah, but it starts out on a right note.

clarence: Yeah.

Stanton Shanedling: It's starting out.

Stanton Shanedling: And, and then, you know, then you also judge, I think, or connect,

Stanton Shanedling: On levels of transparency as your relationship

Stanton Shanedling: matures, okay? You know, like, you know, Clarence could ask, you know, is Stan still transparent? You know, in the back of your head, you might be, you know, you might think, is it, is he still as transparent when we first met?

Stanton Shanedling: Or have things changed? And if they've changed, why have they… why have they changed? Is it because, Stan is retired now? Does that… does that make it…

Stanton Shanedling: different. Well, yeah, it makes it different, but does that… does that… affect transparency.

Stanton Shanedling: You know…

clarence: This is what Sam… here's the other thing, though, I want to say about, about, about friendship.

clarence: And I had to learn this, is that, people… People that are your friends.

clarence: You also have to watch how they treat their other friends.

clarence: Okay? Because people, people… People will pretend with you

clarence: And then you'll find out something different about them, and how they really, really… how they really, really treat their friends, and then you wonder, like, is that how you do that? For example, for me, I remember friendships where people would come to me, and they would talk about their other friends.

clarence: You know what I mean? And they would say things about their other friends, and I'm wondering, like, is that what you're gonna do with me?

Stanton Shanedling: You know what I'm saying?

clarence: And so, for me, like, I'm gonna invest my relationship, my interests, my passion with you when you're not…

clarence: true.

clarence: to what you call real friendship, you know what I mean? So, I think health, I mean, in terms of talking about health, and I think it's a very good, a good, interesting topic, but in terms of talking about friendships and health, you really have to examine what you call a friend.

clarence: And really examine what do you really want from a friendship? And what can you really, really provide and give in a friendship?

clarence: And then, you know, ultimately, what outcomes are you expecting from a friendship? And I think that

clarence: that's what we don't often do. We just like somebody. Oh, yeah, we just like you, and… and… That don't work. Anyway, I'm… okay.

Stanton Shanedling: So, you know, I would… you know, I don't know if you remember, you know, Clarence, when we were growing up, there were cliques.

Stanton Shanedling: You know, the…

clarence: India.

Stanton Shanedling: or groups

Stanton Shanedling: of friends. So, you know, you know, I thought I would just touch on this a little bit. So, you can have individual friends, like one-on-one, and then you can have

Stanton Shanedling: group-oriented friends, like, you're part of a group that kind of.

Stanton Shanedling: melds together. You know, like, when we were growing up, clicks, you know, you had these kind of clicky-oriented,

Stanton Shanedling: relationships with, with, with certain people. I personally, have found, certainly as, as, as you get older, that,

Stanton Shanedling: you know, it's just an assessment that I've made that individual-oriented friends, you know, these more one-on-one.

Stanton Shanedling: types of friends.

Stanton Shanedling: I believe relate more to your health than a group of friends or a clique

Stanton Shanedling: of friends. A group or a clique of friends, it takes more energy, I think, whereas just a one-on-one,

Stanton Shanedling: you can maybe relate better. Does that ring a bell with you guys?

clarence: I'm gonna let Matthew go, because I've been talking a lot. Go ahead, Matthew.

Health Chatter: I think so. I think you just get to have…

Health Chatter: More intimate discussions or conversations, or a more deeper connection, if you will.

Health Chatter: on a one-on-one setting, as opposed to group settings or clicks, so I would agree with that.

Health Chatter: And so I have a friend group now that a lot of us graduated, from grad school together in public health or public health adjacent fields, so I would say, in this group setting.

Health Chatter: I would say the opposite is true, because we're always… all of us know so much knowledge about public health that we're all kind of, like, encouraging each other to, you know, be healthy, or check in on your status, or things of that nature. But I would agree with that, by and large. And I think in some other groups, friends that I have, I'm…

Health Chatter: the health person, that I'm the one encouraging folks to, like, hey, you should go to the doctor, or you should check that out, or you should maybe not smoke as much, but

Health Chatter: I think so, I would agree with that, Stan.

Stanton Shanedling: Yeah, and it's also, we've also created groups of… of friends through

Stanton Shanedling: these kinds of media, like Zoom.

Stanton Shanedling: Okay, groups.

Stanton Shanedling: it's not very often, for instance, that I have a Zoom meeting, just a one-on-one with somebody. If that's the case, sometimes I'll just call, you know, just, you know, it's like, I know what Clarence looks like, I don't need to see him on a screen, you know what I mean? But,

Stanton Shanedling: But…

Stanton Shanedling: I think things have kind of morphed a little, a little bit, but I… I do relate to the idea that,

Stanton Shanedling: Individual one-on-one friends seem to connect more with health.

Stanton Shanedling: than perhaps groups do. What do you think about that, Clarence?

clarence: Yeah, I do. I think, I think that,

clarence: You know, it's so funny,

clarence: when I think about friendship, I think about, you know, the individuals, as you just talked about, you have more intimate conversations. I think when I'm in a group, I mean, it's just, you know, I don't know, it's not competition, it's just chatter. We have a whole bunch of chatter.

Stanton Shanedling: Yeah.

clarence: You know what I mean? And sometimes the chatter that we have is not necessarily, the healthiest.

clarence: You know what I mean? Your friend, like, hey, you know, and people go off on all kind of tangents and things like that. So, I just think that,

clarence: You know, as we talk about

clarence: As we talk about this thing about… about friendship, and you just want to be around… you… you really want to be involved with people that are… that really do care about you, the individual.

clarence: And, and, and the betterment, But, yeah.

Stanton Shanedling: Individual one-on-one friends seem to connect more with health.

Stanton Shanedling: Than perhaps groups do. What do you think about that, Clarence?

clarence: Yeah, I do. I think, I think that,

clarence: You know, it's so funny,

clarence: when I think about friendship, I think about, you know, the individuals, as you just talked about, you have more intimate conversations. I think when I'm in a group, I mean, it's just, you know, I don't know, it's not competition, it's just chatter. We have a whole bunch of chatter.

Stanton Shanedling: Yeah.

clarence: You know what I mean? And sometimes the chatter that we have is not necessarily the healthiest.

clarence: You know what I mean? Your friend, like, hey, you know, and people go off on all kinds of tangents and things like that. So, I just think that,

clarence: You know, as we talk about… as we talk about this thing about friendship, and you just want to be around… you… you really want to be involved with people that are… that really do care about you, the individual.

clarence: And, and, and the betterment. But, yeah.

clarence: So, yeah, the individual… the individual conversations, to me are much more

clarence: Intent, and more, and better.

Stanton Shanedling: Yeah, connected.

Stanton Shanedling: Right. Yeah, yeah. You know, so the other night, I got together with, you know, with the same friends who I went with on Saturday for dinner, and

Stanton Shanedling: I realized, as a good friend of theirs, that I needed to connect with them by asking

Stanton Shanedling: this kind of question. How are your kids?

Stanton Shanedling: You know, how's your family? How's everything going for you? Okay? Right. So that the conversation doesn't focus…

Stanton Shanedling: Just on me, but it's a two-way thing, so that you're… you're… You show that you care.

clarence: Right.

Stanton Shanedling: In both directions, do you know what I mean? Yeah.

Stanton Shanedling: Anyway, this is… this has been, I think, a great conversation, and I… and I hope that, that our listening audience

Stanton Shanedling: has time to reflect a little bit, after you listen to a show like this, on how special friends can be, and how… how important they can be to your health.

Stanton Shanedling: Overall.

Stanton Shanedling: And it's… and I really do believe that friends are a good potion. They really are. If you have a cup, and you want to drink something called Friends,

Stanton Shanedling: drink from that cup, because it'll help you through a lot of… a lot of things.

Stanton Shanedling: Last thoughts, Clarence?

clarence: You know, I think that we kind of alluded to this, or said this, about

clarence: And I think Matthew was talking about the, you know, the perfection of how people perceive friendship. It's gonna be perfect. It's not perfect. It's a… it's a struggle.

clarence: It's a struggle, you know what I mean? It's a struggle. I mean, anybody that's… everybody's my friend, well, I question that, really. But I do think that,

clarence: it's important to have friends. I think that in our… in our disconnected world,

clarence: even though we're connected by technology, and in a disconnected world in terms of relationships, it's important for you to figure out

clarence: what it is that you really need from people.

clarence: You know, versus what everybody else says you need. And I think all of us are individuals, and we have certain needs that certain people can help to address. And so, don't assume just because somebody talks good that they're gonna be a good friend.

Stanton Shanedling: Right, right.

clarence: Find somebody that you can really, truly relate to, so that would be my thought.

Stanton Shanedling: Matthew, last thoughts.

Health Chatter: I think friends are incredibly important, and I…

Health Chatter: I've built a life surrounded by friends, and I'm really happy about that, and I hope, as I continue to move on, that

Health Chatter: through adulthood, that I continue to develop those friendships and have those, and so I think when we relate it back to health, I think friends are critical to health, and especially as we go through health problems, friends are part of our support system to help us get through those times, so…

Health Chatter: I think they're incredibly important, and I hate to hear that people don't have as many friends nowadays, or this loneliness epidemic that's happening.

Health Chatter: I really hope we can do something about that.

Stanton Shanedling: Yeah, I do too.

clarence: Yeah.

Stanton Shanedling: Good point. So, as it relates to that lonely, lonely aspect, so I live alone, I have my dog, but I live alone, and, I've realized that you need, you know, especially if you live alone, you need to have

Stanton Shanedling: types of friends in case there's an emergency, or there's something that comes up. And I'll tell you, true friends… true friends.

Stanton Shanedling: And I put the word true in quotes.

Stanton Shanedling: True friends are somebody that you really can call

Stanton Shanedling: in an emergency, and they'll be there. They will be there. So my last thought to everybody is nurture friendships. It's good for your health.

Stanton Shanedling: So with that, it was a… it's a great show. Thanks so much to Clarence and Matthew. Our next show for our listening audience will be on, ready for this? Retirement

Stanton Shanedling: and health.

Stanton Shanedling: Oh my goodness, right? So stay tuned for that. In the meantime, everybody keep health chatting away!